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sunray's wench

If there was a proposed halfway house or bail hostel planned for your street, would you be protesting and signing petitions to get it moved somewhere else (and if so, where?) or would you be OK with it?


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Silas Sydenham

I live in a completely different milieu (Australia), where halfway houses are rare, simply because they're rarely needed. There's no doubt that aftercare is needed for released prisoners and folk discharged from other institutions. We regard this as the responsibility of their families and the communities from which they came. The slack is picked up mostly by faith-based organisations. The Society of Saint Vincent de Paul, The Brotherhood of Saint Lawrence, and the Brown Sisters are the main players in this field. But most folk agree that congregating ex-offenders (even a few) in a single location is a REALLY BAD IDEA. Housing is found, and drop-in services are provided to people where they live.
Our system works well, mostly because the majority of parole/probation officers are unpaid volunteers, usually nominatated by their Church, and so are not driven by arbitrary performance indicators.

But to deal with the nub of the question - would I want a halfway house in my neighbourhood? Yes! I live in a gentrified middle-class area, and I feel ex-offenders give colour to the neighbourhood, and a pool of folk more likely to volunteer for community causes.

 
Anonymous

I would just move away. This is harsh statement, but I want to be honest. Maybe I still need to clarify, why I feel that way. First of all, I have kids. My son got beaten by unknown people twice when he was just 13 (once in playground and once just near our home). He's normal, regular boy, with no gang-relating stuff etc. (I don't even think, that there are such a things as gans here). I would never take a chance to live in neighborhood, that is unstable. Bad things can happen everywhere, I know, but I can minimize risk.
Other thing is, that in Finland, you get ridicolous punishent after murder. We just have this case, where female had commit ritual murder (including cannibalism) with three other people, got 8 years, was only four in prison (first timer), and after three or four years killed again, got 8 (maybe 10, I'm not sure) years, but because she had not commit any crimes in three years, she is again dealt as a first timer, and will be in prison only for four years. She was prisoned 2008 and will be released next year. She even escaped from open prisoner, and believe or not, in Finland that is not a crime! So she just have to go back to normal prison, but nothing more.

So, as you see, in Finland you can kill as many people as you want, sit pitiful few years in prison and get free again. So no, I don't want to leave with my kids near those people.

I think, there are prisoners, and then there are prisoners. I hope you undestand my point.

p.s sorry for my bad English...

 
Elsbeth

I am not that au fait with the rehab houses for offenders - but I live in a lovely UK Sea Side resort with a rather well known drug/alcohol rehab and a record number of half way houses. This rehab is in the middle of quite a nice area, the first 'independant' stage is just down the road, again in a residential area. Drugs and Alcohol addiction is often financed by crime and there is quite a high failure rate in rehab and that area isnt any more hit by crime etc than lots and lots less than some of the estates.

I am greatful for the residents of that area for not protesting as although he is became an ex with his behaviour I still helped him through his rehab - he was 4 days from death and it saved his life. I am sure that these halfway/rehab places also save lives albeit in a different way.

 
GlitterChick

knowing me-since these *types* are my *people* i would prolly go over there and volunteer! lol :)

 
hitthehighway

We do have hostels for ex offenders here in the UK. I have taught courses to some of the guys that are in there, where I live. You know its like everything in life, there are the good and the bad.

 
whitediamonds

I am all for rehab of inmates and having halfway houses to help them get back into society, but..... I can honestly say that I would not be comfortable with one being put anywhere on my street. While my Pits and ADT will help dissuade anyone from breaking into my house, I have four kids to think about. I would be terrified for their safety every minute of every day. I know that there would probably be some precautions with putting people that were convicted of certain crimes living anywhere within a certain area of children, I still wouldn't be able to rely on that.

It makes total sense to me, to not want to raise kids next to a group or cluster/group of ex inmates.

Yes, anything can happen in any neighborhood but, to place any risk at your door is just not a good idea. Just not a concern those raising their kids should be expected to feel comfortable with.

 
sunray's wench

.... I have four kids to think about. I would be terrified for their safety every minute of every day. I know that there would probably be some precautions with putting people that were convicted of certain crimes living anywhere within a certain area of children, I still wouldn't be able to rely on that.

I'm sorry but that makes no sense. You are assuming that anyone placed in a halfway house wants to harm children and that simply is not the case. Do you let your children out of the house at all?

 
robin1978

I am all for rehab of inmates and having halfway houses to help them get back into society, but..... I can honestly say that I would not be comfortable with one being put anywhere on my street. While my Pits and ADT will help dissuade anyone from breaking into my house, I have four kids to think about. I would be terrified for their safety every minute of every day. I know that there would probably be some precautions with putting people that were convicted of certain crimes living anywhere within a certain area of children, I still wouldn't be able to rely on that.

 
Aimie

I grew up with a rehabilitation centre behind my house and not once did we ever have any problems with the people that stay there or attend. The lot where the centre was built, was previously just a place for kids to hang out and drink, fight, rally cars and all sorts. My mam shares her back wall with the centre, so it's not as if it is miles away in the middle of a field... The centre has been there about 12 years and not once has my mam had any complaints. She feels safer because of the security of their camera's, she knows that if anything happens it will be seen by someone or caught on camera. As far as the safety of my little brothers are concered, I don't think it ever entered her head. At the end of the day anyone who says drugs crime and child abusers are only from low income neighbourhoods or "slums" have to seriously get their head out of their ***. People who are worried about groups of "these types" of people in their neighbourhood need to take a closer look at the people who are already living beside them. Who's to know that the neightbour living beside you is a previous drug abuser who sought help before being arrested or caught, or that the person across the road from you, where you child plays out their back garden hasn't done time for doing something stupid when they were a kid, but had the support network behind them to help re-build their lives once they were released. They need somewhere to re-gather themselves once they've been released and what better place to do it than a place that makes them feel welcome and that they can be forgiven, that society won't be looking down their noses for the rest of their lives. How many times have we read on the news teacher abuses child, celebrities stealing, drink driving, causing damage to public property, and yet we trust teachers with our children and if a celebrity moved into your street you'd think it was cool. Well inmates are these people too. For anyone on this site or anyone who writes to an inmate to be so narrow minded about something that has the oppertunity to change someone's life for the better needs to sit back and ask why it's ok to pass onto another area and not yours. Those people who your afraid of probably mean the world to someone else on this forum to with whom they would trust their life. I might be scared terrified of the thought of one of your pp's living next door to me but it doesn't mean you would, if I expressed this concern with you, you would probably think me crazy and be offened at my total lack of sympathy, so think before you judge. Because for all we know they guy who holds the door open for you in your apartment block or the kid cutting your grass every other weekend could be someone who would crawl in your window at night and murder you or steal from you while your not looking to feed his drug habit no one knows about.

 
francine364

half way houses have rules and are supervised. these men and women dont want to go back to prison they just want a chance to get there life back. theres not going to be drunken disorderly meth prostetution parties in half way houses. As far as my children are concerned I teach them about stranger danger. I dont know many of my neighbors and who knows what they are doing behind clothes doors.

 
YMIHere

[QUOTE=Xray48;980644]As in all "rehab" programs, their failure boils down to a lack of money. It just makes me wish that I was independently wealthy, so that I could offer them jobs that would give them a sense of pride, training and accomplishment. But, I guess that is what makes me a bleeding heart liberal. [B]"If wishes were horses, beggars would ride."[/B][/QUOTE]

I have a MegaMillions ticket for tonight's drawing...$145 MILLION DOLLARS!!!! I'd set up my foundation and get busy doing the work that I love.

I use that expression all the time. Don't remember when I first heart it, but it surely rings true.

 
Xray48

As in all "rehab" programs, their failure boils down to a lack of money. It just makes me wish that I was independently wealthy, so that I could offer them jobs that would give them a sense of pride, training and accomplishment. But, I guess that is what makes me a bleeding heart liberal. "If wishes were horses, beggars would ride."

 
Kirsty

Yes but our "stretches" are generally a lot shorter than in the US and we make much more use of probation and community sentencing.

Again OT, but if a sex offender had been convicted of a Romeo and Juliet-style offence, why on earth would it matter if they lived next door to a school? Honestly, there are far more sex offences than child molestation.

I feel there's way too much leniency here with sentencing, too many people getting bail, barely a slap on the wrists, barely half of a sentence served, plus the jails here are a luxury, they're better off than i am! *jealous*

In my area, aswell as having the school, are alot of vunerable people, i didn't just mean child molestation. There's been a few incidents in my very small town over recent years with sexual attacks, but only since i moved here 8 months ago i found out there was a paedophile staying at the other side of the school *shakes head*

 
sunray's wench

Over here, there's no halfway houses. Once you've done your stretch, you fend for yourself. Why be "mummied" back into the world? IMO, it'd be the worst way to try and get yourself back on your feet, you'd still evidently be depending on someone.

Throw folk in at the deep end!

And OT - i've lived next to worse tbh, and i wouldn't mind a halfway house kinda thing in my area aslong as there was no sex offenders/paedophiles as there's a school practically out my back garden! Before anyone says "as if that would happen!" it did....lol

Yes but our "stretches" are generally a lot shorter than in the US and we make much more use of probation and community sentencing.

Again OT, but if a sex offender had been convicted of a Romeo and Juliet-style offence, why on earth would it matter if they lived next door to a school? Honestly, there are far more sex offences than child molestation.

 
Kirsty

Alternatively, would you prefer there to be no halfway houses at all, and for inmates to do their entire sentence and then be let out onto the streets with no further supervision?

Over here, there's no halfway houses. Once you've done your stretch, you fend for yourself. Why be "mummied" back into the world? IMO, it'd be the worst way to try and get yourself back on your feet, you'd still evidently be depending on someone.

Throw folk in at the deep end!

And OT - i've lived next to worse tbh, and i wouldn't mind a halfway house kinda thing in my area aslong as there was no sex offenders/paedophiles as there's a school practically out my back garden! Before anyone says "as if that would happen!" it did....lol

 
Anonymous

As one Brit to another, would you want to live on an industrial estate? Or would you rather live close to your family?

No I wouldn't want to live in an industrial area but I am not an ex con. They would have their freedom so what difference is it where they are? As long as they had use of public transport etc.

I just made a suggestion as having these places in residential areas doesn't seem to work, crime rates go up, property prices fall. My father is a victim of one of these halfway houses so I know the effect it had on him, wasn't pleasant......

 
theotherlondon

If there was a proposed halfway house or bail hostel planned for your street, would you be protesting and signing petitions to get it moved somewhere else (and if so, where?) or would you be OK with it?

On my street live one block down from a methadone clinic and one block up from a
homeless shelter.

Find no problem at all, just think it makes the area more "interesting".

No fear.

 
karleigh

As one Brit to another, would you want to live on an industrial estate? Or would you rather live close to your family?

Beggars can't be choosers.

 
sunray's wench

I think these places need to be built in industrial areas, and on a transport route too. NOT in residential areas, absolutely not.

As one Brit to another, would you want to live on an industrial estate? Or would you rather live close to your family?

 
whitediamonds

People don't want these places in affluent areas, because it will bring property prices down.

True fact, they did not build next to a halfway house then complain it was there, their money home is an investment. Normally most times to raise their kids in a safe community.

People don't want these places near schools or playgrounds - which are more likely to be found in lower-income areas.

Of course not, not a good positive enviorment for young kids to play or witness.

People don't want these places in rural areas, because there is no transport (even though the inmates themselves may have originally come from the rural areas and may be better off being close to their families).

Yes, fact is they need to be near public transportation, a reality. Many have family near city not just rural, family can come to them or viice versa if family is there for them.

People don't want these places in already crime/drug-heavy areas because it will (supposedly) increase this activity/draw others in.

Not good for the inmate trying to adjust in the middle of criminal activity either.

So where should parole hostels or halfway houses be? Or are we all saying, in a roundabout way, that we just don't want these places? Or we do, but not anywhere near where we live?

Naddy has a good idea of where in her post, jobs near, transportation etc

 
Anonymous

My father owned a shop in a very afluent area and one of these halfway houses was built. The crime went up as soon as it opened. Prostitutes standing on street corners, drug deals happening in front of your eyes, thefts of cars and buildings, including my dads shop on many occasions. My father eventually sold up and was glad to get away. Even though there was thousands of complaints by residents this place is still there.

I think these places need to be built in industrial areas, and on a transport route too. NOT in residential areas, absolutely not.

 
Numbercruncher

Sunray~it's definitely a thought provoking thread! But I still feel strongly that these types of placed don't belong in "middle class" residential areas. As I said before I'm not interested in taking a hit on my property value because of halfway houses. From an economic standpoint, putting them in lower income neighborhoods makes sense because it's not going to drive down the property value to the extent it will in middle class neighborhoods. Like it or not, the crime rates coming out of people in half way houses is far greater than that coming out of "middle class" homes. So, why "redistribute" the crime into middle class neighborhoods? There will ALWAYS be high crime areas and they will always be associated with lower income neighborhoods. That's a fact of life. There's no changing that. So, I think the best place to put half way houses is in areas that will have the least amount of affect on the city's/town's economic demopgraphic. The only thing accomplished by putting half way houses in middle class neighborhoods is risking the sustained financial viability of that area or town.

 
KAM

People don't want these places in affluent areas, because it will bring property prices down.

People don't want these places near schools or playgrounds - which are more likely to be found in lower-income areas.

People don't want these places in rural areas, because there is no transport (even though the inmates themselves may have originally come from the rural areas and may be better off being close to their families).

People don't want these places in already crime/drug-heavy areas because it will (supposedly) increase this activity/draw others in.

So where should parole hostels or halfway houses be? Or are we all saying, in a roundabout way, that we just don't want these places? Or we do, but not anywhere near where we live?

It's a mixed up, messed up situation, in that no matter where one is placed, there will be a group of people offended by it. Unfortunately in this day and age people are more worried about offending people, then in doing what is right. Being PC has gone so far overboard it is near impossible to accomplish anything. I say build the halfway houses where they are needed; close to jobs and people, where they can re-enter society, and feel like a part of it. Think about it, if they get out, and do not feel like society has made them belong, then they will be more apt to do something to go back to where they do fit in and feel comfortable.

 
sunray's wench

People don't want these places in affluent areas, because it will bring property prices down.

People don't want these places near schools or playgrounds - which are more likely to be found in lower-income areas.

People don't want these places in rural areas, because there is no transport (even though the inmates themselves may have originally come from the rural areas and may be better off being close to their families).

People don't want these places in already crime/drug-heavy areas because it will (supposedly) increase this activity/draw others in.

So where should parole hostels or halfway houses be? Or are we all saying, in a roundabout way, that we just don't want these places? Or we do, but not anywhere near where we live?

 
whitediamonds

My thoughts too, for the most part.

Peanut and others, why keep going on about how these places might be near playgrounds, schools etc? Are you saying that no one on parole should go near a playground - what if they have children of their own and were in prison for any other crime except child abuse? If my husband came home tomorrow on parole, I'd hope you wouldn't want to deny him taking our grandson to the park.

No no one is saying that no one on parole should go near a playground(although) many may have the restrictions of no where within so many feet of a school,playgorund etc.

if your hubby left the halfway house and goes to a park with your grandson, if allowed by law, sure why not? An individual if free otherwise to go wherever...

As far as these places halfway etc housing has a wide span of who stays there, (Groups by the numbers) goes in and out of, each individual with different issues. Again this group setting should be no where near schools, playgrounds etc...

Why would they even want to be in the first place???

 
sunray's wench

OK, here is my thought on this; I would be fine with a halfway house on my street. The reasoning is simple, and that is the more resources inmates have upon leaving prison, the less likely they are to to repeat the actions that caused them to get locked up in the first place. As a condition of parole (for many), the inmate must have an approved place to parole to, if family is not available, a halfway house is the only other option. My "nephew", that I had mentioned in a previous post, had an awful time finding a place to go on release. His family would not take him in, and the local halfway houses were full, so he was denied release until a spot at one opened. 5 long months he waited for an opening. Stop and think what that would do to you emotionally, if you were paroled by the state, and then told you must remain locked up indefinitely, until suitable placement can be found. I do not know about other states, but that is how California handled it.

My thoughts too, for the most part.

Peanut and others, why keep going on about how these places might be near playgrounds, schools etc? Are you saying that no one on parole should go near a playground - what if they have children of their own and were in prison for any other crime except child abuse? If my husband came home tomorrow on parole, I'd hope you wouldn't want to deny him taking our grandson to the park.

 
KAM

If there was a proposed halfway house or bail hostel planned for your street, would you be protesting and signing petitions to get it moved somewhere else (and if so, where?) or would you be OK with it?

OK, here is my thought on this; I would be fine with a halfway house on my street. The reasoning is simple, and that is the more resources inmates have upon leaving prison, the less likely they are to to repeat the actions that caused them to get locked up in the first place. As a condition of parole (for many), the inmate must have an approved place to parole to, if family is not available, a halfway house is the only other option. My "nephew", that I had mentioned in a previous post, had an awful time finding a place to go on release. His family would not take him in, and the local halfway houses were full, so he was denied release until a spot at one opened. 5 long months he waited for an opening. Stop and think what that would do to you emotionally, if you were paroled by the state, and then told you must remain locked up indefinitely, until suitable placement can be found. I do not know about other states, but that is how California handled it.

 
YMIHere

On our street? No...

Somewhere near transportation, as many do not have a vehicle when first out, or had problems that may not be able to have a drivers license for a while.
Even metro bus does not run where we are at, and taxi would be expensive, plus in the US unless inside the a city, most need a car, or travel to get to jobs. As well as rehabs or mental facility's.
Most if on parole or probation, the offices are located in the inner city, not suburbs.
Inner City also offers more opportunity to blend in w/o as much stigma as the outside city limits do. Most community or neighborhoods have or live there for their children to be safe, and playgrounds and schools near. Just not appropriate or wise to place in this atmosphere for anyone involved.

I think the question was aimed at would you personally oppose. Not to go into it all from a practical standpoint. I'm pretty sure she meant all other things being equal would you have a problem with it?

 
whitediamonds

I think a lot of people do think that a halfway house or bail hostel is the same as a rehab centre though. They assume that the people there are all druggies or alcoholics, or sex offenders. It doesn't seem to enter their heads that halfway houses are more likely to be used by those who did not commit those types of crimes. But then would it be "safer" to live down the street from a burgler, or a drug addict? Why do we draw these strange lines around which crimes are perceived as dangerous, when danger is as relative as the individual committing or being the victim of the crime?

Perhaps there should be a whole new breed of residential care centres to cater for released inmates? But at what point after a sentence has finished or parole has been granted do you remove the bars at the windows? Perhaps drug addicts should be treated in hospitals instead of in the community? Or not treated at all? I don't know, just mulling things over.

At what point do you remove the bars at the windows? When the individual is ready which does not happen the day released if just came out of prison.

A drug addict if insurance coverage which actually many do, are in hospitals and those who do not have coverage are or can go to state facilitys. Some places they can come and go as please, back by certain time at night, and when return a urine test is run first.
Others more intense are locked in, and go thru levels to reach independence.

A halfway house for ex inmates, is a rehab for them to become more independent, as well as find jobs, etc at the pace they as an individual needs. Some it seems no matter what support out there, just cannot change old thinking and end up back inside, or back on drugs or whatever. Just hard wired I guess...

 
whitediamonds

If there was a proposed halfway house or bail hostel planned for your street, would you be protesting and signing petitions to get it moved somewhere else (and if so, where?) or would you be OK with it?

On our street? No...

Somewhere near transportation, as many do not have a vehicle when first out, or had problems that may not be able to have a drivers license for a while.
Even metro bus does not run where we are at, and taxi would be expensive, plus in the US unless inside the a city, most need a car, or travel to get to jobs. As well as rehabs or mental facility's.
Most if on parole or probation, the offices are located in the inner city, not suburbs.
Inner City also offers more opportunity to blend in w/o as much stigma as the outside city limits do. Most community or neighborhoods have or live there for their children to be safe, and playgrounds and schools near. Just not appropriate or wise to place in this atmosphere for anyone involved.

 
fee

When my sister lived in her old flat (in the uk so it was different) the block next to her was turned into a homeless block and a whole lot of people moved there, not all were criminals but the majority of them were drug users...rapidly the area started to go "downhill" houses were broken into even people were being mugged on the street..she had a young kid there and was scared for him which i can understand but no help was offered to her..the best thing she could do was move out of there by taking a house from the council that no-one else wanted...she did this and landed lucky.

 
YMIHere

When you figure out the answers, please let our Congress know.

 
sunray's wench

I think a lot of people do think that a halfway house or bail hostel is the same as a rehab centre though. They assume that the people there are all druggies or alcoholics, or sex offenders. It doesn't seem to enter their heads that halfway houses are more likely to be used by those who did not commit those types of crimes. But then would it be "safer" to live down the street from a burgler, or a drug addict? Why do we draw these strange lines around which crimes are perceived as dangerous, when danger is as relative as the individual committing or being the victim of the crime?

Perhaps there should be a whole new breed of residential care centres to cater for released inmates? But at what point after a sentence has finished or parole has been granted do you remove the bars at the windows? Perhaps drug addicts should be treated in hospitals instead of in the community? Or not treated at all? I don't know, just mulling things over.

 
YMIHere

I made the same associations of drugs and such not because I confuse the two, but because if it's NOT a rehab center then you likely have people who are not even working a program living down the block, but that doesn't mean they have stopped using. That's not to say that ALL criminals use drugs, but a lot of them do and will do the same stupid things that they were doing when they got locked up in the first place. My attitude is the same - if they run a tight ship and keep their people in line so that I can continue to feel safe then it wouldn't bother me.

 
sunray's wench

So you would put people who probably came from a "low-income" neighbourhood in the first place which had already failed them, right back into that same neighbourhood and expect them to somehow do better this time?

What about the people who live in the "low-income" neighbourhood who are not druggies or prostitutes and who work hard but just don't earn enough money to buy their own home elsewhere, sounds like you would sacrifice their safety to protect your own? You make it sound like drugs addicts only live in slums, which is most definitely not the case.

I was just curious, because we have all extended a hand of "friendship" to people who could easily be placed in a halfway house (which is not the same as a rehab centre, but appears to have the same associations with a lot of people) and yet some of us only want to do it at a distance. If your penpal was offered a halfway house bed, would you still not want them living in the same street as you, or would that be different because you "know" them?

Alternatively, would you prefer there to be no halfway houses at all, and for inmates to do their entire sentence and then be let out onto the streets with no further supervision?

 
Sweets06

I'm with numbercruncher, and no I wouldn't want it. I have a child and need him to grow up in a safe environment not somewhere where druggis and cho mos are being rehabilitated besides I'm sure zoning laws would prohibit this sort of thing especuially near schools. Get help but do it in an area that would respectably suit your needs. You wouldn't put a strip club in the middle of a neighborhood, its just not appropriate.

 
Numbercruncher

I'm definitely for rehabilitation. However, as a property owner, I'd say definitely "not in my backyard" only because that would have a significant impact on my home value. Seems logical to put those kinds of facilites in low income areas where the property values are already rock bottom.

 
jaxzter

[FONT="Comic Sans MS"]this actually happened 2 me when i lived in philadelphia pennsylvania. the home i owned was located on a very large urban city block in a lower income area an old age home that had been empty for a while was turned into a halfway house located accross a rear lot and apartment complex behind my house.the increase of crime both theft prostitution and drugs got really bad there. anything of value was stolen out of my back yard even the rusty wraught iron gate to the entrance!cars with prostitutes parked behind the house to do their business and condoms would litter the lot trash would be dumped there and gunshots at night could be heard we had to move. i do not blame it all on the halfway house but it was a start to the fall of the neighborhood economy was the biggest facter no jobs lead to crime.thats the bottem line:aGoodbye:

 
fee

What YMI said..the thing id be scared of too is if my kid (hes 12) though that what these guys did to get rich quick was cool.

 
YMIHere

GREAT TOPIC!!!!!

It depends. Quite obviously I want the guys to be able to receive help. Let me put it like this: I am not against it where I say simply put, "Not in my back yard" where there are some people who would just know it's COMING and do just what you said. However, if the residents were being unruly and I was watching them day in day out staggering around drunk or high, I'd probably sign a petition to get them evicted.

I want the inmates to have a chance to get on their feet and I'm not gonna squawk about having burglars living right around the corner from me, but if I was suddenly afraid of being accosted by someone high on meth while walking home, then I would complain.

And maybe I can say this because I DON'T have small children now, but to that end I wouldn't complain about the sex offenders either though I almost tend to be more on the fence with them. I don't think they should have to wear that scarlet letter, BUT I do recognize that some, not all, can be very dangerous to me.