On the fence

Thanks everyone. Before i asked the question i was thinking i needed to step back and really look at everything, but i really wanted to hear other opinions, and everyone seems to have the same ideals as me, I'm going to cut down in my writing and just match what he write, because at times i'll mail him a letter every day and i may get 2 a week back, so i think he is a bit spoiled on the whole i'm going to out write him on everything. So for a little while i'm just going to write when he writes and really look at the tone of everything, because i think i've been so lost in the ideal of starting a new life and getting things ready for that, than to really see if we can actually ride the time together...I don't always like the ideal of being in an open relationship..but it's really about trust at the end of the day. Since i actually decided to quit my second job for now, and only work40 hours a week instead of 60-80 a week, it will give me more time to honestly see everything that is happening, and not get so stressed out due to lack of time, and just feeling rushed. Because i think i'm creating problems in my head that are not even there because i'm misreading things and not really taking the time to think about everything that is being wrote.
Thank you again for all your advice it really helped me.

I'd cut him some slack. He's probably just talking in general terms. He has a lot of time left to do, had never lived as an adult outside of a lock-up and has a long list of things he wants to do. My man talks like this sometimes. "When I get out I want to go here, eat this, buy that, build a house there". I don't feel that he is excluding me. He has a long time left to do and he isn't yet making concrete plans of exactly what he and I will do, where we will live, what he will cook on Wednesday nights, etc. it's too early for that and things will change between now and then anyway. Right now my man has a thing about getting a red car when he's out. Who knows? Several years down the line he might change his mind and decide a black car is what he wants.

My penpal, on the other hand, gets out in a year. He is making very concrete plans. He asked me by JPay the other day whether I thought an iPhone was better than a Samsung phone. He has been browsing the used car ads in a newspaper that a neighbour gets and working out how much he will need to save to put a down payment on a car. He also asked me look into the locations of goodwill and charity places where he might be able to get some furniture and things to start out with before he can afford to buy new ones.

I don't worry that my man isn't at the stage of picking furniture yet or asking me what colour scheme I want for the living room. That will come in time.

Just be happy he is making future plans and not resigning himself to a life of failure and rejection. It's very easy in prison to get down-hearted about the future. Encourage his plans, even if they don't seem to include you. He might even be kind of testing you to see how you react to his plans. If my man says "when I get out I want to go to Brazil" I don't say "what? Without me?" I say "that sounds cool. So-and-so went there and had the best time ever. I've heard the food/beaches/landscapes there are amazing".

I don't think that asking for time together before you decide to uproot your entire life is out of line.
When I told Dreamboat about that plan he thought it was a good one. It gives us time to get the physical (not just sexual but actually being around each other) connection that we don't have now and gives me time to get acquainted with Oregon and see what my life will be like.

I think if you express it again as a comfort thing and maybe not as a "I need to decide if we're going to be together or not". I know I want to be with the Boat and presumably you know you want to be with J. It's not about whether or not you love him and want a life together as much as it is about having time before you make a major life decision and give up the entire life you've established for a completely different one. (Or at least for me, that's what it is)

I was thinking about writing him a letter today when i got in from work, explaining myself and just telling him how i feel about things, not be cold and not be like we need to decide the rest of our lives this moment. And you are right, for me it's not about loving him or not loving him...i don't have a problem moving...but it would be nice if we could have US time first, so make sure we click, not just sexually, but everything..i may have a little habit that drives him nuts...and he may do something like tap his fingers all that time, and yeah i so dislike that...i don't know, maybe he is acting cold because he is thinking something i'm not and just is not sharing. Only time will tell..i'm just kind of taken back for him to write cold when he never has before...we have had disagreements, in the past...but he has never been cold.

Perhaps seeing as you have an open relationship with him he didn't feel the need to include you in his decisions. Lots of guys in prison say they want an open relationship and they don't want you waiting or putting your life on hold. What they really want is for you to say you wouldn't even think about doing that. A lot of times it's a test. Maybe that's why he's pulling away and doing his own thing.

I don't think that asking for time together before you decide to uproot your entire life is out of line.
When I told Dreamboat about that plan he thought it was a good one. It gives us time to get the physical (not just sexual but actually being around each other) connection that we don't have now and gives me time to get acquainted with Oregon and see what my life will be like.

I think if you express it again as a comfort thing and maybe not as a "I need to decide if we're going to be together or not". I know I want to be with the Boat and presumably you know you want to be with J. It's not about whether or not you love him and want a life together as much as it is about having time before you make a major life decision and give up the entire life you've established for a completely different one. (Or at least for me, that's what it is)

I don't think I'd do something deliberate that could be perceived as game playing, but just naturally back off a bit as a form of self preservation. You shouldn't have to play games to get a man to prove that he wants you. Maybe he's appearing cold due to having other things on his mind (the transfer). In a good relationship one should be able to express one's feelings and concerns....if you can't do that then the relationship doesn't sound solid. Sometimes it's difficult for an inmate to think so far ahead as they are putting all their efforts into getting through a day at a time....and if they're coping with something outside of their typical day it can become all-consuming.

I actually see your point, and i agree with both of you. Normally i'm a give what i get kind of person, you are cold then i'm cold back...but i have not been cold back to J over what i feel as him being cold to me, i just explained my point about him not saying anything about if he still wanted me to move with him or not, and i'm just waiting on the reply..

i've dropped back in writing..and if i get another cold letter from him, i was kind of going to tell him i don't like the frost treatment since i've never been like that...but if he wants to be frosty...just wait because he has no ideal how cold a female can be...that and i'll talk to him mom about him being cold. He dont seem to like me saying i wanted US time because i move across the country, cause if he came here i already had the money put back for a ticket from him to go to washington if it was not a good match. He might just be acting like a baby, cause of the second guessing things. Baby just might need a time out.

I don't think I'd do something deliberate that could be perceived as game playing, but just naturally back off a bit as a form of self preservation. You shouldn't have to play games to get a man to prove that he wants you. Maybe he's appearing cold due to having other things on his mind (the transfer). In a good relationship one should be able to express one's feelings and concerns....if you can't do that then the relationship doesn't sound solid. Sometimes it's difficult for an inmate to think so far ahead as they are putting all their efforts into getting through a day at a time....and if they're coping with something outside of their typical day it can become all-consuming.

He's probably just miffed that you said you wanted time together with him before you decided for sure.
I think he'll get over it. He probably thinks he's being as cold to you as he perceived you saying "we should hang out for 2 weeks first to make sure it fits".
Men are stupid...they get something in their head the wrong way and then act like babies.
I would just call him out on it...and address the issue (or at least...it seems like that's when he started being cold was after you said that).
A rumble might get things back to normal...or it might flush out some major issues that you two should be discussing.
Either way...babies needs to be called on their bullsh1t :)

Pixie, honestly my advice would be to match his tone in your letters to him. You don't need to make any dramatic decisions right now. Just follow his lead and see how he responds. This will tell you a lot without getting into a messy and convoluted discussion about where each of you stands. No doubt you both have your ambivalent feelings.

I'm going to see if just being as cold as he has been being to me, give him a clue unlike others i'm not afraid to walk away from what is not a good thing for me. It's all a wait and see what happens kind of thing, because we still have a lot of time left to do, by the time he gets out, my children will be grown so at least they will not be babies anymore. I'm just stressing i guess...because we have done so much time already and then he goes getting kind of cold after all this time, just because i asked his opinion on some of the advice the ladies here have given me.
I've kind of stopped writing him as much already, because i was writing him a letter ever other day, but when i got his last 3, to be honest they read really cold to me, so i was like really..you don't really answer any of my question just inform of what you are doing...so i i've only been writing when he writes. So we will see if he will make the effort to write more, or if he will just let me return to the shadow from which i came.

Pixie, honestly my advice would be to match his tone in your letters to him. You don't need to make any dramatic decisions right now. Just follow his lead and see how he responds. This will tell you a lot without getting into a messy and convoluted discussion about where each of you stands. No doubt you both have your ambivalent feelings.

I agree. No need to discuss it....it will happen naturally. If he feels like you're slipping away and he doesn't want that to happen then he'll do something about it....if he doesn't, then so be it.....it's no loss if you 'lose' someone who isn't right for you. Whatever happens you'll be just fine Pixie, with or without him. Learn to relax and go with the flow sometimes :-)

We talked about him transfer back to the west 2 years ago when he first got moved to PA, he was telling me he has to wait for his numbers to go down so he could go back out west, so i knew he would be doing it, i just did not have an ideal of when. The whole vibe of his letters has changed, since i asked him how he felt about us having a trail period before we full moved in together, that is when he started saying HIS plans, and stopped saying our plans, or how do you feel about this? It's more he is going back to washington, because his people have everything set for him there..about a month ago he asked if i would be willing to move to the rez, and i don't have a problem with moving, but i think we need US time first before i move my whole house to the other side of the country. i can live anywhere. But his last 3 letters (we have a lot of mail going back and forth) were all about HE is doing this, and HE is going to restart his life there, but he did not even ask, if i still wanted to move to be with him...Or said anything about us in this new life he is writing about. And that is not like him normally, we have been writing 8 or so years, and he has never wrote in this way..That HE is doing this..it has always been this is what he would like to do and asks how i feel about it, or can we talk about it to have a happy middle of whatever the topic is.
I actually don't mean to judge him by what my girls "inmate" did, but it just does make me wonder if i'm setting myself up for the same thing..just like when i read other post about different woman getting played by there "man" i wonder if maybe i'm getting played as well.. I think i might want to drop back to just friends with him, until everything is sorted out, but with making that choice, i don't even know how to tell him that, without it seeming like i don't still care for him.
I need to learn to take care of me..Taking care of my kids i'm actually good at..i've been blessed with wonderful children that do well in school, and don't break the law. I have a lot to think about with J, and try to figure out if this is what is going to happen..i'm just in the i don't know what is the next step is, and i don't even know if we will make it..right now his focus is getting back west...yeah i'm in Ohio...the first thing that popped in my mind was...why is he wants to be as far away from me...but that was me being selfish..since as of yet i can't even see him because they keep dening me on this visit list...no real point in staying close in miles to me when i can't even see him.

Pixie, honestly my advice would be to match his tone in your letters to him. You don't need to make any dramatic decisions right now. Just follow his lead and see how he responds. This will tell you a lot without getting into a messy and convoluted discussion about where each of you stands. No doubt you both have your ambivalent feelings.

Pixie, why do you say you will never get on his visiting list? Even if he with the feds, you can try for a special visit. I say push for it because you two really do need to meet face to face. I think it's an important missing piece here.

I agree it's an important missing piece, and i've wrote him about me requesting a special visit, and have not gotten an answer to that letter yet...because i don't just want to show up without him knowing, because he is one that likes to do things when he is getting a visit..get his hair braided he has long hair (native) and get his clothes pressed, and he will wear his necklace the beaded on for his tribe. And i promised when we first started doing this whole try to get me on his visit list, that i would not just show up without telling him.

So he already knew you'd be okay with his transfer? What's making you think he wants to start his new life without you? Is that just because you feel he hasn't been saying 'we' recently?
Regardless of what happens in other people's relationships, I don't judge my man on another person's behaviour. I trust him. If you don't feel you can trust him then take a step back. 6 - 9 years is a long time.....it's a lot to give all that time to someone if you're not sure. There's nothing wrong with keeping the door open for a relationship with him, but just get on with your life. Your focus should be on you and your children first and foremost...there's enough room to fit him in without making him your life's priority :-)

We talked about him transfer back to the west 2 years ago when he first got moved to PA, he was telling me he has to wait for his numbers to go down so he could go back out west, so i knew he would be doing it, i just did not have an ideal of when. The whole vibe of his letters has changed, since i asked him how he felt about us having a trail period before we full moved in together, that is when he started saying HIS plans, and stopped saying our plans, or how do you feel about this? It's more he is going back to washington, because his people have everything set for him there..about a month ago he asked if i would be willing to move to the rez, and i don't have a problem with moving, but i think we need US time first before i move my whole house to the other side of the country. i can live anywhere. But his last 3 letters (we have a lot of mail going back and forth) were all about HE is doing this, and HE is going to restart his life there, but he did not even ask, if i still wanted to move to be with him...Or said anything about us in this new life he is writing about. And that is not like him normally, we have been writing 8 or so years, and he has never wrote in this way..That HE is doing this..it has always been this is what he would like to do and asks how i feel about it, or can we talk about it to have a happy middle of whatever the topic is.
I actually don't mean to judge him by what my girls "inmate" did, but it just does make me wonder if i'm setting myself up for the same thing..just like when i read other post about different woman getting played by there "man" i wonder if maybe i'm getting played as well.. I think i might want to drop back to just friends with him, until everything is sorted out, but with making that choice, i don't even know how to tell him that, without it seeming like i don't still care for him.
I need to learn to take care of me..Taking care of my kids i'm actually good at..i've been blessed with wonderful children that do well in school, and don't break the law. I have a lot to think about with J, and try to figure out if this is what is going to happen..i'm just in the i don't know what is the next step is, and i don't even know if we will make it..right now his focus is getting back west...yeah i'm in Ohio...the first thing that popped in my mind was...why is he wants to be as far away from me...but that was me being selfish..since as of yet i can't even see him because they keep dening me on this visit list...no real point in staying close in miles to me when i can't even see him.

So he already knew you'd be okay with his transfer? What's making you think he wants to start his new life without you? Is that just because you feel he hasn't been saying 'we' recently?
Regardless of what happens in other people's relationships, I don't judge my man on another person's behaviour. I trust him. If you don't feel you can trust him then take a step back. 6 - 9 years is a long time.....it's a lot to give all that time to someone if you're not sure. There's nothing wrong with keeping the door open for a relationship with him, but just get on with your life. Your focus should be on you and your children first and foremost...there's enough room to fit him in without making him your life's priority :-)

OMG, Birdy, I just noticed your ticker and had a very big hearty laugh! You're awesome!

your right, i need to take a step back and look at everything and find the worth of it all...i'm been so closed focused on things i'm failing to see the big picture. To me it's worth the wait..but then again, i don't want to give my all, just to be nothing at the end of the day...i guess i already know all these answers, that we should go back to the friendzone until he gets out, and we can have some US time to see if it would even work, so getting on his visit list does not look like it will ever happen. And if he can't respect that, then it will show me what i really mean, and show that i've been stressing for nothing.

Pixie, why do you say you will never get on his visiting list? Even if he with the feds, you can try for a special visit. I say push for it because you two really do need to meet face to face. I think it's an important missing piece here.

he has 6-9 years depending on how much good time he can earn. I knew he was going back west before he got out, because his people are there, but it would have been nice to get a heads up before he actually filled the papers, instead of oh i might be gone to the next place in a month or a few months i finished my transfer papers. Up until i sent him some of the advice i had gotten from the last questions i asked..he was always about us doing this and that...then i get a letter i'm going back to washington what are your thoughts on that. And i've told him from the begining i don't have a problem with moving, i'm very close with his family so it's not like i would be going where i did not know anyone..i don't know i just feel like he wants to start his new life without me, but wants me to ride with him until he can start it...We will see i guess nothing i can do but wait...i just don't even know anymore...i never used to question things with him this much...but after one of my friends "inmate" got out and yeah lets just say she got played so i don't have to give to many details...it has me questioning everything.

So he already knew you'd be okay with his transfer? What's making you think he wants to start his new life without you? Is that just because you feel he hasn't been saying 'we' recently?
Regardless of what happens in other people's relationships, I don't judge my man on another person's behaviour. I trust him. If you don't feel you can trust him then take a step back. 6 - 9 years is a long time.....it's a lot to give all that time to someone if you're not sure. There's nothing wrong with keeping the door open for a relationship with him, but just get on with your life. Your focus should be on you and your children first and foremost...there's enough room to fit him in without making him your life's priority :-)

That's the risk everyone takes if they are romantically involved with and inmate......you could ride his time with him only to find that it was for nothing. I would suggest that you play it by ear. There really is no rush (he still has six years? Or have I remembered something incorrectly?). If you keep enough of yourself for yourself then you'll be strong enough to keep on your feet should everything go a$$ up. No one knows for sure whether their relationship will even last throughout the entire sentence, so it really isn't worth stressing out until you know what the score is.
Yeah, I can understand you feeling a bit upset that he has made plans without including you - I think I would too. But perhaps he did it because it's one of the few things he can do for himself (without help)?

You spend too much time stressing, Pixie. Let things find their own level...you'll both find out whether you are right for one another when the time is right ;-)

he has 6-9 years depending on how much good time he can earn. I knew he was going back west before he got out, because his people are there, but it would have been nice to get a heads up before he actually filled the papers, instead of oh i might be gone to the next place in a month or a few months i finished my transfer papers. Up until i sent him some of the advice i had gotten from the last questions i asked..he was always about us doing this and that...then i get a letter i'm going back to washington what are your thoughts on that. And i've told him from the begining i don't have a problem with moving, i'm very close with his family so it's not like i would be going where i did not know anyone..i don't know i just feel like he wants to start his new life without me, but wants me to ride with him until he can start it...We will see i guess nothing i can do but wait...i just don't even know anymore...i never used to question things with him this much...but after one of my friends "inmate" got out and yeah lets just say she got played so i don't have to give to many details...it has me questioning everything.

[QUOTE=Saskatchewanian;1124090]He's not out for a long long time. I think you should just stop worrying and decide "is this worth it to me if we don't end up together"? If not... end things and maybe try getting back in touch when he's closer to being out or suggest you guys dial it back to friends and live more of a free life until it's close to when he gets home. I think the plan (the his or the us or the my) will change a lot over the next years. It's hard to know exactly what is going to happen...[B]so you just need to decide if it's valuable in your life to keep on as you are or if something else might be more valuable.[/B]

None of us know if we're going to end up in relationships with our dude...so how I justify waiting is that there is sustained value in doing so. Even if I don't end up with him, I won't regret this time.[/QUOTE]

Wise words of Sask, I will keep this in mind for other tasks I carry out in life...

That's the risk everyone takes if they are romantically involved with and inmate......you could ride his time with him only to find that it was for nothing. I would suggest that you play it by ear. There really is no rush (he still has six years? Or have I remembered something incorrectly?). If you keep enough of yourself for yourself then you'll be strong enough to keep on your feet should everything go a$$ up. No one knows for sure whether their relationship will even last throughout the entire sentence, so it really isn't worth stressing out until you know what the score is.
Yeah, I can understand you feeling a bit upset that he has made plans without including you - I think I would too. But perhaps he did it because it's one of the few things he can do for himself (without help)?

You spend too much time stressing, Pixie. Let things find their own level...you'll both find out whether you are right for one another when the time is right ;-)

your right, i need to take a step back and look at everything and find the worth of it all...i'm been so closed focused on things i'm failing to see the big picture. To me it's worth the wait..but then again, i don't want to give my all, just to be nothing at the end of the day...i guess i already know all these answers, that we should go back to the friendzone until he gets out, and we can have some US time to see if it would even work, so getting on his visit list does not look like it will ever happen. And if he can't respect that, then it will show me what i really mean, and show that i've been stressing for nothing.

He's not out for a long long time. I think you should just stop worrying and decide "is this worth it to me if we don't end up together"? If not... end things and maybe try getting back in touch when he's closer to being out or suggest you guys dial it back to friends and live more of a free life until it's close to when he gets home. I think the plan (the his or the us or the my) will change a lot over the next years. It's hard to know exactly what is going to happen...so you just need to decide if it's valuable in your life to keep on as you are or if something else might be more valuable.

None of us know if we're going to end up in relationships with our dude...so how I justify waiting is that there is sustained value in doing so. Even if I don't end up with him, I won't regret this time.